Heart-transformation
I really appreciated this post by Mrs. Wilt. It echoes my heart-cry and what I so desire to promote on this blog and most importantly, through my life.
In my short lifetime, I've been guilty of much legalism and putting people and ministries up on pedestals. A few years ago, through some painfully heart-wrenching situations, those pedestals came crashing down in pieces and I learned firsthand that looking good on the outside is not enough. Heart-transformation is what is most important.
I was discussing this with a friend recently and sharing with her how I look back a few years ago and see how I often judged a family by their outward appearance - Did they homeschool? Did they have a large family? Did they dress modestly? - and so on and so forth. How short that fell! You can dress modestly, have a gaggle of children, and homeschool, and have no heart for God. Outward appearances can be very deceiving and sadly, I've witnessed it.
Our outward convictions and standards should be an outpouring of the inner working of God's spirit in our life and nothing else. Don't do something because a Godly family you know does it or because a certain ministry encourages it. Seek the Lord, search the Scriptures, and strive to glorify and honor Him and Him alone.
Mrs. Wilt says:
...[A]s believers we must be truly cautious. Our caution must lie in the fact that although by all appearances things may be good, we must align every thing we allow in our homes to God's infallible Word. We must ultimately look at our persons as "heart mirrors" reflecting God's truth to an unsaved world, not rely on our exterior "flesh mirrors" to reflect Him. Although I firmly believe that the changes of the heart based on salvation will cause a concern for the worldly exterior as well, we must make certain that it is indeed the heart tuned to Christ and not a vain desire to "fit in to Christian circles" that causes each conviction in our lives to occur.Dear friends, holding God's Word as our foremost authority in all things removes much of the doubt and decision in our lives. Let us look only to Him for our "lists"!
I am grateful for the Lord's patience and long-suffering with me as He continues to shape me more into His image. I want to be a vessel fit for His use, even if it means many painful circumstances to bring me closer to Himself. May the Lord bless each of you as you seek to glorify Him with your lives.
posted by Crystal Paine at 11:59 AM
34 Comments:
Well said!
I like this post. This is hard for me as well. I also fall into this trap: My boyfriend goes to a large church where the women dress a certain way, etc. I don't dress this way, and every time I see these ladies outside church, I feel that I am doing something wrong and they will not believe that I am spiritually mature because I don't dress the way they do. I ALWAYS dress modestly, but I don't always wear skirts, as these ladies. I have always left this open to God to change my heart on, but am I wrong for feeling this way sometimes? I suppose that I am sometimes wrong. Who knows? This is such a big topic in my life right now. Can we hear from others and maybe more on how we can transform our hearts more like Christ?
Anonymous: My encouragement to you is this - focus on the Lord and seek Him with all of your heart. Seek to please only Him and stop worrying about what others think. Obviously, we shouldn't be a stumbling block and there are times when we might need to do something in deference to another Christian, but our heart's desire should be to please the Lord. Maybe the Lord wants you to change the way you dress and that is why it is "bugging" you or maybe He wants you to learn to stop worrying about what other people think. Perhaps you could ask your parents (if you have a good relationship with them) or your boyfriend, or another trusted spiritual mentor in your life for some direction and counsel.
All of your life, people will disagree with you and hold different convictions than you. How you respond to these is what either makes you a stronger, Godly woman, or a bitter, self-centered woman who is always worried about living up to other's standards instead of seeking to please the Lord alone
To give a personal example: Almost every single day, people come to me with caution, counsel, and rebuke. Having a blog like this, I open myself up for that. At first, it was really hard for me to deal with the constant rebukes and criticism, especially from those who call themselves Christians and sometimes from dear friends. Over time, the Lord has helped me to see these as blessings not frustrations and to accept them from His hand. I seek to hold these rebukes up to the light of Scripture, to examine my heart, and to ask for my husband's counsel. Sometimes, they are founded and I need to confess my error and seek to change or sometimes they are very unfounded and I try to let it roll off my back and not worry if I am not pleasing someone else. My job is to focus on pleasing the Lord and my husband. Whether a rebuke is founded or unfounded, either way, it keeps me humble and constantly seeking the face of the Lord. If everyone were always patting me on the back, it would be easy to think I'm "something." These constant criticisms help me to remember that I am nothing and apart from God's grace, I am unable to do anything meaningful.
So true. I am guilty of judging people as well. Scripture tells us not to judge one another and commands that we love our neighbors. Sometimes it helps when I tell myself that being a Christian is a matter of the heart, and has nothing to do with outward appearances. Although dressing modestly is important, we have to understand that God has to work on our hearts in His own timing.
I think we have to keep our hearts open always to whatever God calls us to do, in everything including dress.
Crystal...AMEN(on both the original article and your comments).
Samantha, may I share that the Bible does NOT forbid judging; it simply forbids hypocritical judging. We are to judge sin, false doctrine, false prophets, etc. There are qualifiers though...we must first judge ourselves, the goal of any judgment is to restore rather than condemn, it's to be done in a spirit of gentleness remembering our own fraility with temptation, the motive is always to be love of God and neighbor, etc. One thing we never can judge is the motive of the heart of another; that is God's responsiblity. He doesn't change everyone in understanding and practice immediately upon salvation; we sometimes think He should concerning ourselves and others. Iron does sharpen iron, though...so we should be willing to share what He has shared with us(His timing and way). Hope this helps!
Well-said Joyce!
Joyce,
I've never thought about it that way, and have always taken from scripture that it is wrong for us to judge one another. Thinking about it now, what you're saying makes much more sense.
I find that when we do judge it's often not the kind of judgement that comes from love, it's more of a flesh type of judgement. That's what I took from both posts.
Thanks for the comments, Crystal. I am not sure how the Lord will direct me on this matter. My boyfriend is a preacher, but not a pastor yet. We are planning on marrying, and I know some churches expect a preacher's wife to dress a certain way. I have known this and have thought about it a lot. I am just going to keep seeking God's will for this matter, and maybe He is "bugging" me about it to get me to do this. Anyway, thank you for the response, and thanks for the article. Though you don't always want people buttering you up, I think you deserve it! A woman who stands for the Lord SHOULD be encouraged. I have learned so much from this blog, and it is a blessing!! Thank YOU!!
I totally agree that you cannot judge someone's heart for Christ by their outward appearance. Actually, you can't judge much of anything by outward appearace. An example- my husband and I are both emergency room doctors, but when we aren't at work, we basically look like "bums" - flannel shirts, sweatpants, tennis shoes, no makeup for me, etc. You would never guess by looking at us that we are doctors without our scrubs and labcoats. Anyway, the other day we went to Wal-Mart with our two toddlers. They had been "whiney" in the store, so we did not allow them to ride the toy bus in the Wal-Mart lobby after we checked out. We explained to them that we were disappointed with their behavior in the store, so they could not ride the toy. They didn't complain - they knew that we meant what we said. We sat at a bench next to the toy so that my husband could fill out a card we had just bought for my mother-in-law. While he did this I sat with him on the bench and our two kids sat in the bus, even though it wasn't turned on. A man walked by and thought we couldn't afford to let our children ride the bus and just handed them fifty cents! My husband and I were shocked, but my kids didn't miss an opportunity to go ahead and put the money in the machine before we could grab it from them! So much for outward appearances!
This is a topic near and dear to my heart, as I have been one in the same place and situation you were a few years ago... watching all the pedestals crumble around me. This is such an important issue in conservative Christian circles, and one that I don't think can be addressed enough. It is so vital that we keep our eyes absolutely focused on Jesus... only Jesus. People, ideas, ministries, books, and families all fail, but Jesus remains the same. We need not gain our affirmation from those around us and their approval of our standands or vice-versa, because on Him we can stand and be secure. If our eyes are fixed on Him, He can "guide us with His eye" and we won't be able to look around and be distracted by those around us. How much better it is to be satisfied with Christ and Him alone.
Crystal, I agree so much with your post. I believe that modesty begins in ones heart ultimately. Our culture is very loose and there has been a real dressing down in this country. Even childrens toys such as the popular Bratz Dolls, reflect this indecency. Yet, the christian heart of me would not want to turn away a lost soul entering a church because they are wearing jeans, piercings, etc. Some people do not have a dress wardrobe and/or are not taught how to dress for the occasion. Common sense would dictate that a christian woman should probably wear a dress, skirt or in certain cases dress pants to a place of worship, however common sense is lost in this day and age. God sees and knows the heart of a person and ultimately it is him who will judge in the end.
Mrs. B., God is so very good, yes? :-)
Samantha, there are many a post online by believer and non-believer alike and many a comment within and without the Body of Christ concerning..."Thou shalt not judge"(Matthew 7:1). God's Word will never contradict Itself; verses must always be understood contextually where they live in a chapter and be embraced in regards to what is offered elsewhere in the Bible(otherwise, one could believe the words in the Bible: "There is no God" because of not considering "The fool hath said in his heart...There is no God" Psalm 14:1). These verses from a study on priorities and being torn between two masters were/are helpful to me on the subject of judging who and what from the perspective of God's righteousness:
Matthew 7:1-5(hypocritical judging verses righteous); Matthew 6 and 7; Romans 2:1-24; Romans 13:8-10; James 4:11-12; James 5:19-20;; Galatians 5:16, 6:1; Hebrews 4:15; John 3:17; John 7:23-24; 2 Timothy 2:24-26; I Samuel 16:7; Romans 14 and 15:1; 1 Corinthians 4:5; Philippians 3:2-3, 17-19; 1 Peter 2:21-22; 2 Peter 2:1-2; 1 John 4:1-6; Ephesians 4:14; 1 Timothy 1:3-4, 4:1-6; 2 Timothy 4:2-4; 2 Thessalonians 3:6, 11, 14-15; 1 Corinthians 5:1-3; 9-13; Matthew 18:15-20; Hebrews 5:14; 1 Corinthians 11:27-32; Psalm 19:12-14; Psalm 139:23-24; 1 Corinthians 11:31. There are surely others to consider; hope these help! God wants His Bride to be presented spotless...and He wants His children to love one another by encouraging and bearing burdens. When judging is proper, God receives the glory because He is the One working out all things.
Anonymous from comment 2 and 8, when young and sharing a dinner meal with a friend(God was taking her father from working in manufacturing to being a pastor starting a small mountain Church and school), a conversation still resounds in my mind and heart. Her younger brother was "bothered" by girls being allowed to wear pants in public school; one student wore striped pants sewn in a manner drew attention to the "bottom" and caught his attention. The parents shared that what is in the heart often is reflected externally in speech, facial expression, behavior, and even apparel. Yes, he was encouraged to flee prideful judging and embrace prayer.
Here is a link(opens with music) that may be helpful to you as God takes you to His Word(and what He says and means):
Priceless Woman Ministries
You may also search for the word "dress", "feminine dress", or other wording that comes to mind at:
Ladies Against Feminism
Oh, and how can we transform our hearts more like Christ? We can't but He can. He leads. We yield by hearing the Shepherds voice(admist all the voices) and following Him. He'll graciously and mercifully take you to His Truth in His written Word and conform your heart to be in obedience like His dear Son. Believers are His workmanship; trust Him!
God is so very good!
Please overlook the typos and grammar/spelling errors. Have noticed doing both lately. :-)
This is such a wonderful post, and I'm glad Mrs. Wilt and Crystal both addressed it.
My husband and I are looking for a new church home, and after attending countless churches (really, I'm ready to find that 'home'), we tried XYZ Church.
We really liked this church. My husband and I are what we like to call 'moderates'; neither of us is uber conservative. This church had a nice, traditional worship service, with a wonderful pastor. Service wasn't more than an hour, and we were invited to the church fellowship luncheon after service.
We were welcomed to lunch, and met with countless members of this church. We both expressed an interest in womens', mens' and couples' bible studies. At that point, my husband was told point blank that in order for us to attend bible studies, we HAD to be members of the church. This struck me as a bit inclusive, but we requested that membership materials be sent so that we could continue to attend the church and pray over the possibility of membership. The pastor then told my DH that they would "appreciate" it if I was more 'appropriately dressed' next time we chose to attend.
At this point, I knew what the pastor meant by this comment and poked DH gently to leave. DH,not understanding, asked what the pastor meant. The pastor stated that the way I was dressed is sinful and immodest (I was wearing dress pants and a cute cardigan set).The pastor then began to lecture DH on what HE perceived to be as Biblical and right.
We walked away and haven't looked back. What a shame...I would have LOVED to be part of that church.
While I did consider purchasing a few wool skirts for winter functions, I'm still flabbergasted at how we so easily judge one another's faith by dress. Yes, certain actions are indicative of a Christlike life, but not all...
I'll stick to my jeans and turtleneck sweaters, *thankyouverymuch*. It's cold in Wisconsin! ;)
Crystal,
Once again, I appreciate your comments on this blog. Such wisdom at such a young age. Thank God for His Word, His Grace and His everlasting mercy to each of us. You are a blessing to me!
Andrea,
I know how you feel. Nothing like that has ever happened to me, but when I was a kid, the homeschoolers we "hung out" with sure did give me the looks when they came by for surprise visits. Whenever we knew we were going to be around "dress only" people we would always dress in dresses (we, being my mom and sisters and I). I know it sounds hypocritical, but that was the only way to have friends. We lived on a mini farm in VT and spent a lot of time outside with the animals. We dressed in flanned and jeans most of the time. We also had no brothers so my sisters and I did all the chores. I know some girls say they can do chores in skirts, but I don't think it is practical. After many years of us playing the hypocrite and trying to make people like us we "gave up." I wear pants most of the time and have never felt convicted that this was sinful. How embarrassing for you when the pastor brought that up right in front of you. Not all the Christians who wear dresses only are like them. I have a few friends who feel convicted to wear dresses, but haven't critisized me to my face about the subject. I was pretty bitter about the friends I used to have, but that has gone away especially since I have seen that a lot of them have turned our pretty worldly and left the church. Very sad. I feel so bad for their mothers. It is understandable that you would be mad at that pastor, but I would try to have sympathy and realize that they are excluding a lot of Christians with their strict rules. It is church not a private school.Some things you just have to let go. You can be such a better witness by doing this. When I meet the former friends I used to have a am very nice to them. I bet they are sure puzzled as to what my parents did right. I am not living in adultery and I don't wear clothes that would make Britney Spears blush.
To the soon-to-be pastor's wife,
I would probably start wearing skirts more if I were you. I know it wounds hypocritical, but it might prevent a lot of upsetness. From the pastor's wives I have known, their life seems to be under a microscope. I would try to put myself in the women's place. A lot of them think that wearing pants is immodest. It would certainly help your soon-to-be husband with his job.It is kind of like Hudson Tayler and his pony tail. Just some thoughts.
We had a woman in my church who did dress immodestly out of ignorance. She was a new Christian from a rough background. A lot of the women in the church would gossip about her dress. I felt really bad for her, but I would never tell someone that they needed to cover up. How insulting is that to a sincere person? Even my husband thought she was immodest and I wear pants/dress slacks 99% of the time and he thinks I am perfectly modest!
Well, the pastor's wife (who wins the award for most awesome pastor's wife in the world the second year in a row) took this woman aside, privately, and (somehow) gently told her about her clothes and modesty. She took it very well and understood that when in public she should be covering up a bit more. ; ) She took it so well! I don't know how Mrs Pastor did it.
For those wearing dresses in colder climates, I came across this link that might help with layering and specific clothing ideas(kinda like being a bird that understands puffing feathers to let the air have a thermal effect in the winter chill. smile).
http://www.dressaday.com/2005/08/ask-ms-dressaday.html
Wouldn't everyone think it not proper to think poorly of that pastor that desired women to wear dresses in the fellowship where God had placed him as a shepherd? Men know men and how they can so easily be distracted by the female form(and one must admit pants certainly offer a different perspective of that form than a dress fit for meeting) and make comparisons between other women to their wives. We have liberty with many things as believers but never are we to use it if it is offensive to others and we especially wouldn't want to be a distraction in a time of humble worship, even if it wasn't our intent. Rather than think that fellowship is turning folks away, consider that God might be alive and well in that membership where they don't want the masculinity of men and their apparel compared to a woman wearing pants; maybe folks that don't give them a chance are missing out on what could be learned there(by oldster and new folks alike). On the other hand, there is only one interpretation of Scripture concerning what God desires for us as princesses of the Heavenly King while on earth. We should, because there are differences of opinion, all quietly go to His Word and ask Him to "drive it home" concerning what He does say and mean in our hearts.
With all that said, neighbors where I grew up lived on a farm. The daughters always wore dresses or skirts and blouses regardless of whether in the house or out and about the farm. When their mother was in her 90's and requiring assistance for daily functioning, those girls took turns caring for her in each of their homes on the property and always kept her in dresses, stockings, the typical black older lady laced shoes or beautiful slippers and with a pretty bun for her long white hair. Oh, almost forgot the pretty handkerchief always in her dress sleeve. Isn't that a lovely thought and way to be remembered as a lady?
We humans find it so easy to judge based on all the *wrong* things, that it's no wonder God tells us to be very cautious in judging one another. Not only judging someone as 'wrong' or a 'bad Christian', but also in making snap judgements about the supposed spirituality of people we hardly know. I, too, had a lot of pedestals fall recently. What I think I have to remember is that outward appearances don't matter. The Christians in the Bible were just as guilty as we sometimes are. They had different 'indicators' of spirituality, but the result was the same... they judged others based on things that didn't matter:
"For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love." (Gal 5:6)
I need to keep reminding myself that faith working through love is what matters. Maybe then I'll be a little bit closer in my judgement of others.
Zan -
I'm definitely not mad at all...I figured that we'd run into some type of doctrinal difference at some point. I just didn't expect to be painted as a harlot.
I personally don't feel a skirt or full length dress makes me any closer to the Lord than my nice, flannel lined blue jeans do. A relationship with Christ begins first with the heart and soul. Dresses just AREN'T practical in Wisconsin, and no one will probably be ever able to convince me of otherwise.
Yes, I own wool dresses. I do wear them from time to time. When I know I am going to be inside. All day. Otherwise, its pants for me! In my line of work, dresses really get in the way sometimes, so I have to plan very carefully.
Here is an idea taken from my elderly and seasoned neighbor that might address the issue of pants versus dresses in cold weather AND not be seen as a stumbling block to a stronger or weaker brother when God puts ladies with a mixed company of believers(all the while promoting being kindly affectionate with brotherly love, in honor giving preference to another...love never seeks its own but rather God's best for everyone):
wear a pair of pants under the dress on those bitter cold days(she sometimes will wear a pair of sweats when doing yardwork) and remove them in the lady facilities if need be. Otherwise, for church meeting, she isn't long in the cold with the "to and from" concerning home, car, and fellowship meeting locations so she simply chooses warmer dresses and leggings and shoes or boots and coat. Her 8 children orchestrated a family meeting not long ago to help her locate a 4-wheel drive vehicle because, even in her 70's, she is very determined to fellowship with other believers(and help others run errands that need assistance) even in very inclement snowy, icy, and below zero chill factor weather, Lord willing(she says). :-)
Where there is a will there is a way for the focus to be directed to God. Afterall, remember that some things aren't worth holding onto in sacrificing unity or in speaking against another family member God perfectly judges concerning motives and their desire for purity rather than what they believe to be a little leaven in the lump...especially in regards to those we'll find ourselves with for all of eternity.
And, please do remember that some external judging God does allow. The dress, mannerism, and talk of a strange woman is to be recognized so she doesn't ensnare, for one example. Why would God also exhort to abstain from the appearance of evil if it weren't an allowable judgment? 1 Thessalonians 5:22; Proverbs 6: 16-19
I'm truly not desiring to be perceived as being argumentative or guilty of judging hearts...rather the avoidance of bitterness and the promoting of forgiveness toward healing and peace is what God would have for everyone, yes?
I guess part of a 'heart-transformation' is something that has to include our husbands as well. My husband doesn't see the way I dress as a stumbling block; if anything, he complains that I wear far too many turtlenecks in the winter! :) I just feel that wearing dresses all the time is legalistic, and I don't want to get caught in that trap. I wear nice clothing to church, cover my head when required by church service, and obey my husband when he comments on my clothing.
I've never ever felt that pants, if the right size and appropriately chosen, are a stumbling block. Yes, it is our job to lift our Christian brothers and support them. However (and this is the caveat), it is NOT my job to keep another man from sinning. It is in HIS heart, in HIS duty to keep his mind pure. I do my best to be a good sister in Christ, to not flirt or lead a man on that is not my husband. But I cannot, as a woman, be held accountable for another human being's sin nature.
Perhaps that is what is in my heart, but I cannot control what others do or do not do. I am certainly not trying to be argumentative, but I find this issue frustrating. As Christians, (and I am typing this as I'm listening to Newsong's "The Christmas Shoes"), we should focus our energies on helping those around us. People are starving, people are missing loved ones, people don't know when they'll sleep in a warm bed next or be able to shower. And we have the temerity to debate our levels of (or perceived lack thereof) of Christian-ness.
We just need to be more like Christ...there was a Christian song out there about 'the face of Christ" out a few years back. I can't remember the artist, but it got me thinking...what if that homeless man I just passed by on the street was the Lord? What if that new woman in Church with the tattoo is Christ in human form? I pray that the Lord fixes our eyes upward this holiday season and focus on what the Lover of our Souls would want us to do....Focus on the kingdom, not the castle! :)
Andrea, I think that the most important thing is that you are seeking to glorify the Lord by honoring your husband in the way you dress. We can debate all day as to what is appropriate dress for Christians, but I really think it comes down to our heart - that's the point I was trying to get acrossed here.
Yes, modesty is important, but it must begin with our heart. I know that many people would think things I wear are not according to their modesty standards, I've learned not to let that bother me so long as I know that I am truly seeking to please the Lord and please my husband. There is safety in that. That's one reason I shy away from saying "This is the way a Christian woman should dress." Yes, she should dress appropriately, modestly, and femininely, but beyond that, I can't tell you specifics for your situation because I truly feel that this is an area in which a wife should seek to honor her husband in.
Anyway, I just wanted to encourage you, Andrea, to keep on, keeping on. I see God doing so many great and mighty things in your life and it excites me!
Crystal, I agree with you. Satan loves to trap us in what we perceive as divisiveness. We all must be wary that the Evil One is waiting for an opportunity to embitter and distract us from our Holy Goal.
I'm sorry if anyone misinterpreted any comments I made...God bless those of you that can wear skirts all year long and tolerate it! I can be wearing flannel lined jeans or khakis, two pairs of wool socks and Thinsulate lined boots and STILL be cold! I certainly did not mean to make it a point of contention.
Andrea, the point I was trying to get across is that, yes, while we look to our husband earthly and heavenly, my question is would it have been sin to fellowship a time or two or more with those precious folks God sacrifically loves(maybe then or another time)...with the wearing of a dress and honoring what fellow believers desire and the pastor God put over them deemed best(someone to be honored when he's not promoting sin)? It's a matter of not being adamant and rather being willing to yield with what is a stumbling block to another(maybe not viewed as such to your husband and you or to other couples). Modesty isn't a preference issue but to that congregation "where they are as God's workmanship", it is a matter of pants versus dresses for ladies and we should consider that in our choices.
A pastor I know specifically shared where he was concerning the eyegate and women and the lust factor with his former sin nature and the flesh he still has to bring under submission in Christ's strength in the new nature. God doesn't zap men free of all that enslaves just as He doesn't with women; He takes each where they were and changes each in different ways and timing. Knowing my brother's plight and seeing as he engaged others to be an encouragement and help to him, I would rather be a burden bearer than one to add to it. Another dear pastor shared how, as he traveled and was provided transportation at varied congregations where he spoke, talked of riding in the back seat of the vehicle if a lady of the congregation was the designated driver. He desired that no one was given an opportunity to accuse either of them of anything other than being honorable. Legalism or yielding in spirit and truth and love for the benefit of another precious child of God? See how we can show the world Jesus and love in a practical way? They shall know us by our love for one another in need and even in the meeting of needs with those outside the fellowship God places in our walk with Him.
The issue of pants versus dresses in general, their being modest versus immodest and sin versus righteousness...that is something that is God's place to illuminate in individual study(something not worth bitterness and unforgiveness with those that differ in their understanding of Scripture). God never wants us to argue over such but rather to quietly sit at His feet as His disciples when there are different understandings. It should never be allowed to become a bone of contention with those in Christ. We, as believers and women, have a high calling in Christ Jesus. As Crystal shared, do press onward...and upward!
Ravished with His love,
Joyce :-)
Joyce,
I just wanted you and others who think like you that I don't necessarily think you are legalistic for wearing dresses only. I have been there and done that and I don't think dresses is the only way to be modest and feminine. Like Crystal suggested, I follow my husband in this matter. I do not think a pastor should be telling another man's wife what he or she should be wearing. If the clothing is truly inappropriate, than it is more appropriate that a woman tell her in private as to not embarrass her and her husband.
I think it is also troubling that some people my consider my dressing close to a harlot. Those are very strong words and I think that Christians should be very careful when they talk about dress (especially to women, lol). I have known people who openly say that the way I dress is like a harlot because I don't wear dresses all the time. I have also read on some blogs that jeans are ugly. So I am an ugly harlot. Thanks alot. ;) I am saying this half jokingly because if people really saw the way I act and dress they probably wouldn't think that.
I used to layer my dresses and wear leggings to be warm and I still think it is unpractical and causes a lot of unnecessary laundry.
I think that it is important to distinguish your self from men. I have no problem with Christian women wearing dresses 24/7 and if I went to a church like that I would. However, I will never attend a church like that for that very reason. I am not convicted by dresses only and because of outward appearance I would never feel welcome in such a church and that is ashame. Whether we like it or not this dress issue (like so many others)IS dividing Christians.It is sad but true.Excluding someone from worship is like shunning (yes, I have been shunned before). Shunning is entirely unbiblical.
I also totally agree with you about judging. Of course we should judge someone's actions. Hello?
I really hope I didn't offend any dress only people. If I did, just think how often you might be offending a Christian sister who is reading your words about jeans being ugly. It is similar to this movement about saying that the "homeschool jumper look" is ugly and frumpy. I know a lot of girls who dress that way and I would never in a million years (no matter how many times these women called me a harlot dresser) tell them that their clothing was ugly. I just don't think that is my job.
zan, I think my post above yours addressed what you are saying though it appeared first in order.
May I add that I thought you shared that the pastor had talked to your husband about the clothing issue, a proper order in my understanding when it is a fellowship issue/practice and because you weren't members. It might not have been as proper for a lady member to take it on authoritatively, so to speak? Your husband and you were then free to discuss it? Surely, it wasn't a declaration from the front of the church meeting? :-(
I hadn't shared one way or another whether I wear dresses or skirts 24/7. Always to church meeting in mixed company because the desire is to honor my Lord with the best He has provided in addition to the modesty perspective with brothers and sisters. I don't always wear dresses otherwise yet am drawn more and more to them and am adjusting the wardrobe in that direction as I'm seasoned in years and in relation to being more conformed to the image of Christ. Enjoy the princess factor with my family and the way those outside the home react when dressed as such(and like to be a part of their acting that way, too). Battles are chosen very carefully, seeing as the war is really waged in the heavenlies and not a flesh and blood thing, you agree? :-)
Shunning is okay and something that was only thought of as Amish or Jehovah's Witness teaching until a few years ago. Many churches opt out of such discipline(one on one, then two or three gathered in His name, then before the congregation first before utilized) but it is Biblical and for the purpose of restoration and keeping the lump unleavened for our precious Beloved.
http://www.blueletterbible.org/kjv/1Cr/1Cr005.html#top
Can't talk more now and am sorry if answers seem a bit short and pointed...need to clean the fireplace before restarting and stew prep is calling my name, too!
Love all you dear ladies,
Joyce :-)
uh oh...I interchanged information of Andrea and zan and who shared what in that last post. Please forgive!
Really gotta go!
:-)
OK.
I am so confused right now. ????
I don't have time to figure out what is being said and don't think it is that important. I guess I will just agree to disagree with whatever is being agreed. Agree?
God bless you, Joyce. : )
A big hug, Zan(it was Andrea that shared about the pastor talking with her husband and I wrote as if it was something you shared). Wasn't keeping up very well, was I?
Think there might have been agreement to disagree many a post ago(smiles) though the "shunning" as allowable in 1 Corinthians 5 was elaborated. Sorry if confusion results from me; often my replies are general thoughts that result from study rather than my sharing about me(i.e. whether I "dress or pants".) :-) :-) :-)
May God richly bless you, dear lady; God is good! JOYce
Andrea, as a life-long resident of Wisconsin, now living in Minnesota, I know what you're saying with regard to the frozen tundra!
I'm a homeschooling mom of 5 children, reformed in my theology, conservative politically, and I also happen to be a pastor's wife. I wear women's dress pants to church much of the time in the winter, and even in other seasons. I honor God with my very life and soul, by the empowering of the Holy Spirit. I have sought His will in this regard, and sense that I am walking in that will, with my husband's complete consent and encouragement. My dh has been in ministry for over 20 years.
Perhaps things are different "down south", but here, in my experience, no one has ever confused me with dressing or looking like a man. I would think it would be more difficult to distinguish between male and female clothing in biblical times when everyone wore robes. But I digress ;-)
I do hope you find a church in which you can grow, love, and minister.
Thanks, Joyce.
I did study up on wearing skirts/pants. It wasn't just a bad experience and than I said for get it.
I did read your link about shunning. They are talking about gross sin there. I would love to discuss that more, but this isn't what this post was about.
My family wasn't shunned for what we were wearing or for gross sins, but for what we believed. Long story. It is horrible when your Christian family casts you out and encourages the congregation to not speak or fellowship with you. How are you supposed to get your stumbling brother back?
Another subject for another time.
Take care.
zan, we won't discuss it further here but that chapter concerning shunning was shared because you indicated it wasn't Biblical(I'm saddened to hear your family was shunned but know God wasn't taken by surprise and He still is in the business of working all things together for good to them that love Him! If it was something that needed changed, He is able. Also consider that He might have closed a door and has a window open to something different for your family?).
After a bit of digging because of what you did say, I believe that I need to "think on" this all more concerning our apparel and attitudes it can stir in us and others as to whether it can fall under "covetous or an idolater"(idols of the heart can be varied). Fornication can unfold because immodest clothing can so speedily invite what the flesh is all about. The "gross sins" might begin similar to a little leaven in the lump...a tiny bit of yeast with the right conditions and it grows into something that we all wish would have been nipped in the bud??? There is always something fresh in God's Word; so much so that the more studied the more there is to study. :-)
This heart-transformation post and comments has certainly provoked a desire for me to consider muchly on why women are exhorted to dress in modest(well arranged, seemly) apparel(a lowering, letting down, a garment let down, dress, attire)...with shamefacedness(a sense of shame or honour, modesty, bashfulness, reverence, regard for others, respect) and sobriety(soundness of mind, self-control). I'm very grateful and know the Holy Spirit has some leading through the Word to do with this child; this has really been a blessing. I want to portray a virtuous woman and feminine grace, enjoy being the weaker vessel, and think we all want God to be the One that works it all out with each of us so we bring glory to Him alone.
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